Added log and summary of today's KDE herd meeting.

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+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:30:29] <Philantrop>	!herd kde 
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:30:31] <jeeves>	Philantrop: (kde) caleb, carlo, cryos, deathwing00, genstef, ingmar, jmbsvicetto, keytoaster, masterdriverz, mattepiu, philantrop, tgurr, zlin
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:30:32] <Philantrop>	ping ^^^
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:30:37] <Ingmar>	evening :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:30:38] <deathwing00>	pong
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:30:50] <zlin>	:>
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:31:14] <ctennis>	ctennis == caleb
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:31:19] <tgurr>	meh
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:31:24] <Philantrop>	ctennis: Yes, thanks, I know. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:31:32] <ctennis>	just making sure everyone else did :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:32:05] <keytoaster>	bzzzzz
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:32:09] 	 * gentoofan23 guessed
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:33:02] <Philantrop>	jmbsvicetto, masterdriverz, genstef around? :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:33:11] 	 * cryos|laptop had no clue...
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:33:22] Mode	ChanServ gives channel operator privileges to deathwing00.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:33:28] Mode	deathwing00 gives channel operator privileges to you.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:33:34] Mode	deathwing00 gives masterdriverz the permission to talk.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:34:20] <Philantrop>	Ok, let's start guys! :-) First on the agenda is the bump to 3.5.9 which was somewhat, bumpy... ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:34:24] Mode	deathwing00 gives ctennis the permission to talk.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:34:44] <Philantrop>	deathwing00: Thanks, but this will be open floor anyway. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:34:50] <deathwing00>	ok
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:35:29] <Philantrop>	We have one major issue open: Split and monotlithic ebuilds. Split ebuilds depend hard on split dependencies and won't accept monolithic ebuilds. 
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:35:45] <Philantrop>	Some of us want to change that, some others don't. Your opinions?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:36:33] <gentoofan23>	Well, doesn't it depend on the program? Some could do a || dep on split/monolithic and some can't, right?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:37:25] <Philantrop>	gentoofan23: No, not really as basically any monolithic ebuild would install what its split packages would.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:37:43] <Philantrop>	But we're talking about kde-base/* only here. 
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:38:10] <deathwing00>	My opinion is that we should opt to drop monolithic ebuilds for the following reasons: 1) Applying security fixes and patches to a split ebuild implies less development and maintenance effort, which in turn 2) implies less compilation on users and 3?) if I remember correctly KDE 4 was going to drop monolithic components (how's that by the way?)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:38:46] <keytoaster>	++
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:38:48] <Ingmar>	KDE 4 has had them dropped already
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:38:53] <Philantrop>	!bug 211116
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:38:55] <jeeves>	Philantrop: https://bugs.gentoo.org/211116 maj, P2, All, infoman1985@gmail.com->kde@gentoo.org, REOPENED, pending, kde-base/*-3.5.9 split packages can't be mixed with kde-base/*-3.5.9 monolithic packages.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:38:55] <jeeves>	Philantrop: https://bugs.gentoo.org/211116 maj, P2, All, infoman1985@gmail.com->kde@gentoo.org, REOPENED, pending, kde-base/*-3.5.9 split packages can't be mixed with kde-base/*-3.5.9 monolithic packages.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:39:15] <Philantrop>	^^^ That's the bug. 
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:39:29] <Ingmar>	but I disagree, dropping monolithic :3.5 ebuilds is a regression imho, besides, some slow arches only have those keyworded, and I see no reason to force a change upon them on a version of KDE that's getting EOL'ed soon
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:40:12] <tgurr>	mixing splits and monolithic was never supported by us anyways, was it? possible yes.. sadly :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:40:15] <zlin>	I'm with Ingmar on this one
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:40:31] <Philantrop>	I'd like to keep it the way it is as only a few users even complained and most jsut switched to split ebuilds. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:40:49] 	 * Philantrop scribbles two names into his little black book... ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:40:55] <Ingmar>	well, other users apparently care enough to attach a partial patch
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:41:03] <deathwing00>	we are not planning on offering monolithic ebuilds on KDE 4, are we?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:41:04] <zlin>	tgurr: it used to be possible through the eclasses. 3.5.9 uses EAPI=1 and thus doesn't use those eclass functions anymore...
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:41:11] <Philantrop>	deathwing00: Nope. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:41:17] <jmbsvicetto>	pong
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:41:20] <jmbsvicetto>	sorry, just got home
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:41:22] <Ingmar>	and it doesn't make sense for a user that kdebase + kdenetwork works, but kdebase + kopete doesn't
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:41:30] <Philantrop>	jmbsvicetto: No problem. Thanks for being here. 
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:41:36] <gentoofan23>	I object as some boxes I maintain use monolithic and it'd be a huge pain to switch to split. I imagine many others would feel pain to
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:41:48] <Ingmar>	and that's a good point too
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:41:49] <deathwing00>	If we are to not provide it on KDE 4, we can let it be for now, I guess
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:41:55] <Ingmar>	converting = lots of useless work
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:42:15] <zlin>	gentoofan23: the problem is mixing. not all splits or all monos.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:42:34] <deathwing00>	make all splits block all monos and vice-versa
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:42:52] <zlin>	that's essentially what we have now
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:42:58] <deathwing00>	 "you want a full mono, you got -meta"
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:43:06] <deathwing00>	I agree on that one
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:43:35] <deathwing00>	zlin: is it correctly implemented or are we missing something?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:43:46] <Philantrop>	Ok, let's try a slightly different approach - is anyone here willing to change what we have now? :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:43:59] 	 * Philantrop looks at Ingmar and zlin. *g*
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:44:32] <deathwing00>	we can sort of vote if necessary
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:44:36] <Ingmar>	Guess that means that I'll do it
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:44:49] <Ingmar>	Sure you can vote, but unless you convince me *not* to do it, it's going to happen though :>
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:45:18] Join	mikb has joined this channel (n=mikb@c211-31-30-148.belrs4.nsw.optusnet.com.au).
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:45:19] <deathwing00>	Ingmar: I missed something in here... what is gonna happen?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:45:20] <Philantrop>	deathwing00: Well, I've already recorded opinions. At the moment, we're stuck at 2:2 but if Ingmar volunteers, why not. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:45:37] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: ok, got it
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:45:43] Quit	mikb has left this server (Client Quit).
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:45:53] <zlin>	\o/
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:45:54] <Philantrop>	deathwing00: What Ingmar wants to do is allowing users to mix 3.5.9 splits and monos again. I'm not too strongly against it. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:46:02] <Ingmar>	It's simply stupid to force monolithic users to switch
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:46:38] <Philantrop>	Ingmar: Well, considering that they will have to switch for KDE4 anyway, it wouldn't be too bad, I think, but since you volunteered... :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:46:43] <zlin>	arfie's patch shows what's we want to change.. might not be complete but you get the idea...
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:46:48] <jmbsvicetto>	As I've told others before, I agree that the problems caused by mixing splits/monos is reason enough to have splits hard dep on split
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:47:11] <jmbsvicetto>	But if Ingmar wants to support it, let him
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:47:27] <Philantrop>	jmbsvicetto: Well, a thing Ingmar brought up elsewhere, we might run into even more bug reports now. :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:47:39] <jmbsvicetto>	Ingmar: If anyone else is willing to help you, you might want ot use an overlay to do that work
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:47:45] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: so who is 'yeah' and who is 'nay'?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:48:15] <jmbsvicetto>	deathwing00: I'm a yeay/neah ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:48:20] <deathwing00>	hehe
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:48:30] 	 * gentoofan23 isn't sure if he can vote, so he abstains. :). That's rather paradoxical though 
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:48:36] <Philantrop>	deathwing00: I've recorded you as "nay" to mixing, me too, jmbsvicetto undecided. Ingmar and zlin "yay". :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:48:44] <deathwing00>	ok
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:48:51] 	 * cryos|laptop is nay...
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:48:54] <deathwing00>	jmbsvicetto: decide already
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:49:17] <Philantrop>	cryos|laptop: Just to be sure: "Nay" to mixing splits and monos in 3.5.9?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:49:23] <cryos|laptop>	Yep
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:49:23] <jmbsvicetto>	Ingmar: If you do that work on an overlay, I can try to help on "a few" ebuilds - no promises though
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:49:45] <Philantrop>	cryos|laptop: Thanks, noted. Anything you could add to make Ingmar see the light? ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:50:16] <cryos|laptop>	Philantrop: Just that it really does not seem worth the effort, we looked at this in the beginning when splits were introduced..
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:50:26] <jmbsvicetto>	deathwing00: My view is that allowing that is a good thing, but I understand if we decide otherwise. In any case, I can't commit that to the tree. I can try to help on an overlay though
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:50:48] <zlin>	carlo is clearly a "yay" too and it was supported till 3.5.8
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:50:52] <cryos|laptop>	If he wants to do it I think he should try it but I wouldn't spend my time trying to fix that personally. It seems tough to get it right and I wonder where the pay off is.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:51:27] 	 * cryos|laptop has been largely AFK in recent months though - desktop in a US customs area in New York still :-(
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:51:46] <Philantrop>	cryos|laptop: That's annyoing. :-(
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:52:04] <Philantrop>	Ok, se can we settle this by saying Ingmar may fix it if he wants? :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:52:05] <deathwing00>	I have another argument that you could consider, if we add this for 3.5.9 and then it exists no longer to KDE 4, won't the users be forced into monolithic anyway?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:52:14] <cryos|laptop>	Yeah - delays, delays and more delays. Do have my Gentoo laptop working with KDE4 and 3.5.9 though.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:52:26] <Philantrop>	deathwing00: To split ebuilds, yes.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:52:37] <Philantrop>	cryos|laptop: At least something. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:52:48] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: yeah, that's what I meant
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:52:52] <zlin>	deathwing00: that's a different SLOT though so it doesn't matter all that much imo
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:52:59] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: I agree with that
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:53:15] Quit	ZeRoX has left this server (Client Quit).
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:53:19] <jmbsvicetto>	IIRC, the move forward is another point on this discussion
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:53:32] <deathwing00>	zlin: I understand, but it might be a needless effort, we could focus our efforts elsewhere, m¢ :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:53:39] <Philantrop>	Ok, final call for violent objections against Ingmar changing it. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:53:48] <deathwing00>	no veto here
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:54:07] <zlin>	deathwing00: that just means it's low priority.. :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:54:16] <deathwing00>	zlin: agreed
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:54:22] <Philantrop>	Ok, any other points that should be brought up for the past 3.5.9 version bump?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:55:10] <Philantrop>	Ok, topic 2: KDE 3.5.8 is stable now and will be in the 2008.0 release. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:55:10] <gentoofan23>	I have a point(slightly related). Is there anything wrong with keeping the old stable around a little longer(3.5.7 specifically)?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:55:34] <Philantrop>	gentoofan23: Well, what's wrong with removing it after a newer one has gone stable?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:56:15] Join	ZeRoX has joined this channel (n=zerox@nelug/developer/zer0x).
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:56:16] <Ingmar>	Well, we don't intend to support 5 versions of KDE
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:56:38] <gentoofan23>	Philantrop: Stable users only had 19 days(iirc) to upgrade before 3.5.7 got booted. It bit me in that I needed to install a specific aspect of Kde and only 3.5.8 was available. So I had to upgrade all of kdelibs,base to get that new portion
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:57:11] <zlin>	given that we have a newer version which we know is way better, fixes tons of bugs and noone neither upstream nor downstream want to support the old version...
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:57:26] <gentoofan23>	Ingmar: I'm not suggesting that, I'm suggesting keeping it around a bit longer. 19 days is a little short
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:57:30] <Ingmar>	I honestly don't see why we'd keep old stable versions around when never, better stable ebuilds are available
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:57:33] <Ingmar>	it isn't
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:57:42] <Philantrop>	gentoofan23: Well, yes, I would have thought two weeks were enough to update. It was even for my old Alpha workstation with 233 MHz. :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:58:16] <gentoofan23>	eh, I was a little busy. but granted that, I concede my point I guess
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:58:22] <Philantrop>	gentoofan23: What would have been long enough for you?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:58:35] <Philantrop>	(Under normal circumstances.)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:58:41] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: This falls down to the discussion between maintainers/ats about whether old working versions shold be kept around or not
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:58:55] <gentoofan23>	Philantrop: maybe 45 days?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:59:07] <Philantrop>	gentoofan23: How about 30? :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:59:15] 	 * Philantrop emulates a bazaar. ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:59:19] <gentoofan23>	Philantrop: even that'd be ok I guess
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:59:19] <deathwing00>	30 sounds more reasonable to me
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:59:25] Join	NeddySeagoon has joined this channel (n=NeddySea@gentoo/developer/NeddySeagoon).
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:59:25] Mode	ChanServ gives NeddySeagoon the permission to talk.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:59:30] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: I agree that for maintainers it makes sense to kick old versions - in particular for a project with as many ebuilds as kde
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:59:30] <gentoofan23>	19 is rather unreasonable to me.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:59:41] <deathwing00>	yay to 30 days by me then
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [20:59:54] <Philantrop>	jmbsvicetto: That's why we did it, indeed. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:00:08] <gentoofan23>	hey, Kubuntu is still supporting a KDE from 3 years ago :-P
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:00:08] <Philantrop>	And Ingmar stole all those commits from me! ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:00:19] <jmbsvicetto>	hehe
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:00:38] <Philantrop>	gentoofan23: 30 days are ok then? :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:00:40] <Ingmar>	So next time Philantrop will be so pressed to get thsoe commits, it won't even be 19 days :>
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:00:57] <gentoofan23>	Philantrop: yeah, it should be. Of course, I don't use mips :p
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:01:21] <jmbsvicetto>	gentoofan23: It doesn't matter anymore. mips has gone the unstable road
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:01:35] <gentoofan23>	jmbsvicetto: Oh yes, that is true
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:01:37] <Philantrop>	Ok, anything else on the bump or 3.5.8 in the upcoming release?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:01:49] <jmbsvicetto>	gentoofan23: From now on, mips needs to keyword a version at least until everyone marks it stable
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:02:00] <Ingmar>	they already did
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:02:03] <Ingmar>	monolithic 3.5.9
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:02:10] <jmbsvicetto>	Ingmar: ok
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:02:11] 	 * Philantrop sobs
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:02:21] 	 * Philantrop sees his ebuilds tainted. ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:02:30] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:02:31] <Ingmar>	or he didn't, but he's going to, any time soon :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:03:01] <Philantrop>	Ok, anything else on the bump or 3.5.8 in the upcoming release? (Final call)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:03:31] <Philantrop>	Great. gentoofan23 already brought up topic 3 - Removal of KDE < 3.5.8 from the tree. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:04:02] <Philantrop>	Ingmar kindly killed 3.5.5 to 3.5.7. So we don't have to worry about those anymore. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:04:05] <gentoofan23>	uh, I swear I didn't see that on the agenda.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:04:08] 	 * gentoofan23 hides
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:04:09] <zlin>	so that's done. next! :>
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:05:04] <Philantrop>	Well, I guess since zlin has a hot date with a rubber doll, we should move on to topic 4 - State of KDE4 in the tree. ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:05:24] <tgurr>	Oo
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:05:34] <Philantrop>	Ingmar, zlin: Let's hear - what's in the tree, when's 4.0.2 going in? :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:05:54] <zlin>	well, as such the ebuilds in the tree are in a pretty good state. the deps need to be updated for compatibility with the newly introduced split qt-4.4 ebuilds and it needs to be bumped to 4.0.2 (only kdebase and games have been bumped thus far)...
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:05:54] <Philantrop>	Ingmar, zlin: And: What's the state of KDE 4.0.2 by your findings? :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:06:07] <Ingmar>	Well, some time this weekend, so far we've been busy with the newer Qt
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:06:40] <Philantrop>	And the two of you did a great job with Qt, I'd say. :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:06:43] <zlin>	honestly I haven't had a lot of time to use 4.0.2 yet.. but it'll come in the following days.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:06:48] <jmbsvicetto>	Ingmar / zlin: Can I start working on kdenetwork?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:06:55] <zlin>	jmbsvicetto: certainly
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:06:58] <Ingmar>	jmbsvicetto: Yes, please :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:07:01] <jmbsvicetto>	ok
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:07:07] <jmbsvicetto>	Do you want me to look at anything else?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:07:14] <zlin>	any help with bumping it will be appreciated
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:07:46] <gentoofan23>	eh, I'd help but amd64 AT's need a stable system. :(
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:07:46] <Ingmar>	Right, and that goes for bug reports too :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:07:51] <jmbsvicetto>	I've updated my amd64 and x86 to 4.0.2 during the night, so I can start working on kdenetwork after the meeting
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:08:11] <gentoofan23>	maybe I'll be able to do it,  but don't expect much :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:08:27] <gentoofan23>	s/do/help/
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:08:31] <Philantrop>	As for zlin's plea for help: Anyone who wants to help should simply mail me his ssh public key. Interested users who can show they're able and willing to work on ebuilds are *explicitly* invited, too. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:09:29] <Philantrop>	The bump to 4.0.2 is taking place in a git overlay again to allow for non-ebuild devs to participate, too, and it's a great way to become a full dev as Ingmar and zlin can verify. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:09:48] <Ingmar>	:)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:09:56] <zlin>	and as we want berniyh to do too! :>
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:10:17] <deathwing00>	poor ignorants... they don't know it yet... *g*
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:10:22] <gentoofan23>	well, I might be able to help in places. I
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:10:29] <gentoofan23>	I'll e-mail my key
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:10:46] <Philantrop>	gentoofan23: Ok, thanks, we'll work out the details later.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:11:14] <Philantrop>	Ok, anything else about KDE4 for now?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:12:03] <gentoofan23>	just a question, what's the policy for things from playground/ going into gentoo-x86?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:12:26] <gentoofan23>	various plasmoids come to mind.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:12:27] <zlin>	we can discuss that later
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:12:29] <Ingmar>	It'd be wrong
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:12:39] <Ingmar>	playground is what upstream doesn't consider release worthy
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:12:45] <gentoofan23>	alright.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:13:12] <Philantrop>	gentoofan23: We could have it in the overlay, though. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:13:14] <Ingmar>	Meaning that it may work, but they won't support it
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:13:18] <Ingmar>	definitely
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:13:26] <zlin>	we already have a lot of it in the overlay
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:13:29] <gentoofan23>	Ok.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:13:40] <Philantrop>	Ingmar: They don't really support the other stuff either - see KDE 4.0.0. ;->
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:13:56] <orzelf>	do we ? which cpv ?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:14:02] <Philantrop>	They just release it. Like Pandora did. ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:14:05] <Ingmar>	Pfft, stop being a pansy and use 4.0.2 damnit
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:14:36] <Philantrop>	Ok, anything else about KDE4 for now? (Final call.)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:14:41] <zlin>	orzelf: 6-8 packages...
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:15:01] <Philantrop>	orzelf: Please ask about that in #genkdesvn. The guys there will help you.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:15:05] <Ingmar>	Most of the extragear things is really few work to package it btw
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:15:59] <zlin>	oh, I might be confusing extragear and playground. maybe it's only a couple of packages then. ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:16:44] <Philantrop>	Ok, topic 5 - Herd Testers: Current state and next steps. jmbsvicetto, you're the one in charge with respect to that. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:17:17] <jmbsvicetto>	Well, I haven't done much yet. With the elections and a few other things, I was distracted
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:17:31] <jmbsvicetto>	However, the only person that as contacted me about HT was gentoofan23
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:17:40] <Philantrop>	jmbsvicetto: Yes, I know. You corrupted Neddy and four others. ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:17:47] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: Has anyone else talked with you about it?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:17:57] <Ingmar>	Did you get berniyh's mail? :p
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:18:05] <Philantrop>	jmbsvicetto: No, not so far. What we should
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:18:17] <gentoofan23>	jmbsvicetto: yeah, I was accepted by Philantrop as well. Haven't been doing much though
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:18:17] <NeddySeagoon>	hehe
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:18:23] <jmbsvicetto>	berniyh: Did you sent me an email?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:18:27] <berniyh>	Ingmar: mail?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:18:33] <berniyh>	jmbsvicetto: not that i know of ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:18:35] <Philantrop>	* do is flesh things a bit out, I think so that people know what we'd like to see done. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:18:38] <berniyh>	*none
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:18:52] <jmbsvicetto>	berniyh: ufff! :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:19:01] <Philantrop>	jmbsvicetto: Don't worry, berniyh is worse a slacker than you are. ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:19:11] <jmbsvicetto>	hehe
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:19:20] <berniyh>	jmbsvicetto: maybe he meant that viagra thing? *g*
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:19:32] <orzelf>	Philantrop, zlin : ok ,thx.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:19:55] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: Agreed. We might also want to announce again that we're open for HTs and that people can help that way
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:20:10] <deathwing00>	I can announce that on GMN
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:20:11] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: We might want to push something to gmn and gentoo-pr
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:20:18] <deathwing00>	shall I take note?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:20:21] <jmbsvicetto>	berniyh: :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:20:26] <Philantrop>	jmbsvicetto: Yes, good idea. We'll come to that in topic 8 - misc. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:20:32] <Philantrop>	deathwing00: Yes, please.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:20:42] <jmbsvicetto>	I can also "abuse" the forums for that ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:20:44] <gentoofan23>	maybe have dberkholz put something on the front page? (as in not gmn)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:20:47] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: noted :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:20:53] <jmbsvicetto>	deathwing00: yes, please
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:21:04] <Philantrop>	deathwing00, jmbsvicetto: Can you come up with a good text together? 
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:21:04] <jmbsvicetto>	gentoofan23: that's gentoo-pr ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:21:11] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: sure thing
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:21:16] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: I'll work with deathwing00
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:21:18] <gentoofan23>	jmbsvicetto: oh, k
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:21:26] <deathwing00>	jmbsvicetto: right after the meeting would be a good timing for me
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:21:46] <Philantrop>	jmbsvicetto, deathwing00: Thanks, great! Once you're done, please mail it to kde@ so that we all can review it. Agreed?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:21:57] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: agreed
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:21:58] <jmbsvicetto>	deathwing00: If you could give me 30 minutes to have dinner, my stoamach would thank you ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:22:07] <deathwing00>	jmbsvicetto: no problem
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:22:07] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: sure
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:22:23] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: next ?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:22:29] <Philantrop>	Thanks! Anything else on HTs?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:22:50] <gentoofan23>	other than the fact that I have no idea what to do, no ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:23:07] <Philantrop>	gentoofan23: jmbsvicetto and deathwing00 will get you up to speed. *g*
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:23:11] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: I don't think so. Not at this moment, at least
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:23:18] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:23:34] <Philantrop>	Ok, anything else on HTs? (Final call.)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:23:54] <Philantrop>	Ok, let's move on to topic 6: 
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:23:56] <Philantrop>	6. Lead election:
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:23:56] <Philantrop>	During recent recruitments, DevRel informed us that the KDE project should have
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:23:56] <Philantrop>	a lead as per GLEP39. Some herd members and other devs contacted Philantrop 
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:23:56] <Philantrop>	about it, too, and requested an election. A simple vote on IRC should be held.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:24:01] <deathwing00>	jmbsvicetto: I have to do forums threads as well btw
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:24:09] <jmbsvicetto>	ok
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:24:35] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: I think it's about time we elect some leads
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:25:14] <Philantrop>	jmbsvicetto: Yes, people asked me about that. As most of you know or can imagine, I volunteer. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:25:22] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: That can help, by letting other people know who to talk to
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:25:37] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: O'rly? ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:25:42] <deathwing00>	haha
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:25:51] <jmbsvicetto>	I second your nomination
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:26:02] <zlin>	I even vote for Philantrop :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:26:12] <deathwing00>	Philantrop++
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:26:13] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: I sugest we have 2 leads
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:26:14] <Ingmar>	Same ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:26:27] <gentoofan23>	jmbsvicetto: political power corrupting you? ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:26:49] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: Whether we want an operation and a strategic lead or just a lead and sub-lead, it can help having a failsafe contact
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:26:50] <zlin>	jmbsvicetto: why?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:26:50] <deathwing00>	I think jmbsvicetto means lead + sublead, as in former times
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:27:03] <jmbsvicetto>	gentoofan23: :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:27:25] <jmbsvicetto>	zlin: For the failsafe
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:27:27] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: I think we concluded that we didn't want to split dutties (op + start), right?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:27:40] <Ingmar>	I don't think we need more than one lead, tbh
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:27:52] <zlin>	'dutties (op + start)'?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:28:04] <deathwing00>	op + strat*
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:28:10] <Ingmar>	Some of us are more than active enough on irc, that there's always someone quick enough to answer KDE questions etc
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:28:14] <deathwing00>	actually it's operation and technical
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:28:14] <jmbsvicetto>	Ingmar: What? You just want a lead and an HT lead? :o ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:28:16] <zlin>	ahh, and duties. ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:28:34] <deathwing00>	zlin: my bad :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:28:58] <deathwing00>	I propose to vote if we want to have a sublead first, then vote for candidates
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:29:03] <Philantrop>	I'm with Ingmar on this - the students among us are around anyway. ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:29:45] <zlin>	I'm with Ingmar on this too.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:29:46] <jmbsvicetto>	zlin: The principle behind the strategic + operational lead, was to have someone concerned with the big picture and another person taking care of the day-to-day
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:30:14] <Philantrop>	jmbsvicetto: We all take care of day-to-day stuff. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:30:16] <Ingmar>	Yes, and my point is that day-to-day is more than taken care of
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:30:23] <jmbsvicetto>	ok
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:30:35] <jmbsvicetto>	If you're happy with just a lead, then I accept that
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:30:39] <Philantrop>	Let's vote on the sub-lead, I'd say. Yay/Nay, please.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:30:45] <Ingmar>	not that we can't improve in that, but I don't see a problem, and I don't see your suggestion as a solution ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:30:48] <Ingmar>	Nay
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:30:49] <jmbsvicetto>	I've already seconded a nomination ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:30:49] <deathwing00>	Yay
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:30:51] 	 * Philantrop votes nay
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:30:54] <zlin>	Nay
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:31:02] <jmbsvicetto>	Yay
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:31:17] 	 * cryos|laptop abstains
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:31:17] <jmbsvicetto>	2 Yay - 3 Nay ?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:31:22] <jmbsvicetto>	ctennis: ^^
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:31:30] <deathwing00>	masterdriverz: ^^
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:31:31] <deathwing00>	hehe
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:31:34] 	 * gentoofan23 isn't sure if he can vote...
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:31:42] <Ingmar>	You can, if you say nay
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:31:43] <deathwing00>	gentoofan23: go on
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:31:47] <jmbsvicetto>	Ingmar: lol
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:31:54] <gentoofan23>	nay then
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:32:02] <zlin>	haha
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:32:16] <deathwing00>	I guess, nay passes then
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:32:21] <gentoofan23>	honestly, that *was* my opinion :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:32:43] <Ingmar>	:p
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:33:02] <deathwing00>	so, do we want Philantrop as lead? Yay/Nay?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:33:04] <deathwing00>	Yay
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:33:05] <ctennis>	yay
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:33:09] <zlin>	Yay
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:33:10] <ctennis>	yay above too
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:33:12] <cryos|laptop>	yay
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:33:13] <gentoofan23>	yay
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:33:15] <Ingmar>	yay
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:33:24] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: To do it the right way, we should open a nomination period and then have a voting period
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:33:39] <gentoofan23>	why are we even voting if there is only one nominee? *g*
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:33:53] <jmbsvicetto>	ok, if anyone feels comfortable with that, Yay
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:33:58] <deathwing00>	gentoofan23: well, if over 50% goes nay, then we have to elect someone else
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:34:08] <Ingmar>	If there're any other nominees, I'd suggest them to stand up :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:34:20] <Ingmar>	Else Idon't see the point of an election, waste of time :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:34:29] <gentoofan23>	oh, I guess I was likening it to a political election.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:34:29] <deathwing00>	Ingmar: tell devrel
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:35:07] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: the sublead thing is 3y - 4n
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:35:07] <Ingmar>	So, other candidates?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:35:11] <zlin>	this isn't a political election. we just need the whole team to be comfortable with the chosen lead
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:35:31] <Ingmar>	zlin: right :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:35:54] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: This is another good reason to get gmn and gentoo-pr
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:36:05] <deathwing00>	?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:36:17] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: Let people know about our new lead and remind them of kde HTs
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:36:29] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: ^
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:36:35] <jmbsvicetto>	bah, deathwing00 ^
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:36:35] <Philantrop>	jmbsvicetto: Yes, a sec. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:36:37] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: u sure you don't want jmbsvicetto as your sublead?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:36:46] <deathwing00>	jmbsvicetto: noted
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:36:51] <jmbsvicetto>	deathwing00: Thanks, but I'm not interested
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:37:03] <jmbsvicetto>	deathwing00: If we were to have a sub-lead, I had another in mind
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:37:25] <Philantrop>	deathwing00: Well, let's keep things simple - everyone here can still make decisions so you're all sub-leads, IMHO. :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:37:35] <deathwing00>	hehe
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:38:17] <Philantrop>	For verification: sublead vote: 3 "yays", 3 "nays", one abstention, right?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:38:19] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: can you give me the vote counts on sublead y/n/a and lead election y/n/a?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:38:23] <jmbsvicetto>	wheeeeeeeee! I'm one of the 10+ gentoo-kde executive vps^D^D^Dsub-leads ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:38:24] <jeeves>	dooooooork
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:38:37] <jmbsvicetto>	jeeves: :P
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:38:53] <Philantrop>	lead election: 7 yays, no nays, no abstention.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:39:04] <deathwing00>	noted
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:39:17] <deathwing00>	sublead is a deadlock then?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:39:44] <tgurr>	let's make it a 3 yays and 4 nays then :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:40:04] <deathwing00>	noted
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:40:08] <jmbsvicetto>	ok
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:40:15] <deathwing00>	tgurr: I need your vote on Philantrop :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:40:32] <tgurr>	yay for this wulf thing ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:40:42] <deathwing00>	done with that
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:41:02] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: you have been elected as KDE lead, my congratulations
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:41:13] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: copy-paste your speech here
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:41:14] <Philantrop>	Thanks, guys. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:41:17] 	 * deathwing00 grins
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:41:44] <Philantrop>	I have no speech and I don't want to waste your time so just let me thank my grand-parents, my parents, my wife, my children, my pet... ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:41:54] <Philantrop>	;-))
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:41:58] <deathwing00>	next issue
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:42:10] <Philantrop>	Topic 7 - Review of the project page.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:42:28] <Philantrop>	Apart from the lead thing - what do we need to update=?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:42:37] <deathwing00>	kde-pr could take care of it if you want
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:42:40] <gentoofan23>	lots of kde 3.5.7 stuff.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:42:47] <jmbsvicetto>	stable version + testing version and status of kde4
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:42:52] <gentoofan23>	I have a cvs checkout here, I could update things to a semi-sane state
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:43:14] <Ingmar>	That'd be nice
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:43:16] <zlin>	kde-pr?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:43:36] <deathwing00>	kde-pr: just invented subproject
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:43:47] <Philantrop>	gentoofan23, deathwing00: How about the two of you do it together?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:43:49] <zlin>	who volunteered? :>
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:44:12] <deathwing00>	yeah, I am already asuming these duties
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:44:15] <gentoofan23>	deathwing00: that means you are an indirect sublead :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:44:24] <deathwing00>	gentoofan23: you mean a monkey
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:44:40] <deathwing00>	hehe
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:44:44] <gentoofan23>	deathwing00: well, the two   can be related :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:44:55] 	 * cryos|laptop has to go - duty calls
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:45:00] <cryos|laptop>	Congrats Philantrop :D
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:45:02] <Philantrop>	gentoofan23, deathwing00: Can I take that for a "yes"?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:45:07] <Ingmar>	cryos|laptop: laters :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:45:12] <Philantrop>	cryos|laptop: Thanks and thanks for having been here! 
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:45:15] <gentoofan23>	Philantrop: sure. ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:45:33] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: affirmative, I'll take care of everything that needs to be spread to the public opinion everyone likes, with the help of everyone who likes
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:45:46] <Philantrop>	gentoofan23, deathwing00: Can you do it till the next meeting (next month)?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:45:51] <deathwing00>	cryos|laptop: thank you for sparing your time :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:46:18] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: when is the next meeting? tomorrow?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:46:28] <Philantrop>	deathwing00: next month. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:46:32] <gentoofan23>	Philantrop: probably.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:46:38] <gentoofan23>	I already am editing a few things.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:46:49] <deathwing00>	will do
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:46:55] <gentoofan23>	I'll send any patches to kde@ for review
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:47:04] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: What are we missing?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:47:21] <Philantrop>	gentoofan23, deathwing00: Ok, thanks! :-) And, yes, please, mail it to kde@.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:47:25] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: I'm being poked to have dinner
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:47:44] <Philantrop>	jmbsvicetto: Missing? And poked by whom? :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:47:46] <deathwing00>	jmbsvicetto: meet you here in 35 minutes
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:48:04] <jmbsvicetto>	Philantrop: What other points? I'm at my parents house
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:48:14] <deathwing00>	gentoofan23: can we have talk about it after the meeting?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:48:18] <Philantrop>	jmbsvicetto: Misc and next meeting date. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:48:29] <gentoofan23>	deathwing00: uh, maybe. I might have to go after the meeting though
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:48:32] <Philantrop>	jmbsvicetto: Nothing very special, I think. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:48:37] <jmbsvicetto>	ok
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:48:42] Quit	orzelf has left this server (Remote closed the connection).
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:48:51] <jmbsvicetto>	I'll try to poke in a few minutes
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:49:25] <Philantrop>	deathwing00, gentoofan23: 3, 4, 8, 9 of kde.gentoo.org need to updated, I think. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:49:43] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: noted
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:49:46] <gentoofan23>	what do you mean by all those numbers?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:49:54] <Philantrop>	gentoofan23: The headlines. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:50:01] <gentoofan23>	oh, noted
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:50:16] <Philantrop>	Ok, anything else about the project page?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:50:31] <zlin>	and of course we are here if you need additional info to write it... :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:51:00] <gentoofan23>	just a reminder to someone with cvs access to update proj/en/desktop/ with Philantrop as the Lead of the KDE project
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:51:12] <gentoofan23>	should be a one-liner
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:51:20] <gentoofan23>	zlin: noted, thanks!
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:51:42] <Philantrop>	Anything else about the project page? (Final call.)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:51:56] <deathwing00>	zlin: :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:52:11] <Philantrop>	Topic 8 - Miscellaneous
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:52:14] <berniyh>	gentoofan23: write a paragraph, then it looks like it is important ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:52:33] <Philantrop>	Anyone with anything to bring up?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:53:18] <Philantrop>	Ok, I have one point - as he hinted at earlier, deathwing00 kindly volunteered to help with spreading the news about the Gentoo KDE project. I'd like to take up this offer. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:53:25] <deathwing00>	oh
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:53:25] <gentoofan23>	oh, what about #5 in index.xml? what is the status on monthly meetings?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:53:28] <deathwing00>	let me interrupt
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:54:01] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: gentoofan23 made me notice that we could create a new section about meetings, with dates, sumary and logs
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:54:02] <Philantrop>	gentoofan23: We'll resume that. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:54:33] <genstef>	kde herd meeting?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:54:33] <deathwing00>	summary*
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:54:33] <Philantrop>	deathwing00: Yes, we should updated section 5. I'd like to have monthly meetings again.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:54:34] <genstef>	;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:54:40] <Philantrop>	genstef: Welcome! :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:54:41] <gentoofan23>	right.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:54:45] <deathwing00>	hi genstef
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:55:04] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: noted :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:55:15] <Philantrop>	Anything else for topic 8 - Miscellaneous?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:55:25] <gentoofan23>	one thing to note is that the first saturday of every month is Bugday, not sure if that will make any conflicts.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:55:34] <eroyf>	bugday is dead
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:55:47] <deathwing00>	eroyf: don't blame me plz :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:55:52] <eroyf>	not your fault
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:55:58] <Philantrop>	gentoofan23: Oh, right, most people turned out to have no time during the weekend. What's best for everyone here?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:55:59] <eroyf>	more my fault
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:56:13] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: why not like today?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:56:16] <Philantrop>	Is Thursday good for everyone?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:56:23] <gentoofan23>	Well, it is probably best for me
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:56:29] <gentoofan23>	Sundays are not very good
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:56:41] <gentoofan23>	Thursday afternoons are good, usually
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:57:14] <Philantrop>	I like Thursdays, too. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:57:38] <zlin>	thursday is great
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:57:49] <Philantrop>	Anyone *against* (!) choosing Thursday?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:57:53] <Ingmar>	I prefer thursday over friday at least
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:58:13] 	 * Philantrop hums "It's just another manic Thursday"... ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:58:18] <gentoofan23>	anyone for Mondays? *g*
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:58:33] <Philantrop>	Thursday it is. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:58:44] <deathwing00>	PR: noted
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:58:52] <Philantrop>	Second one, I'd say. Objections?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:59:07] <deathwing00>	first thursday of every month
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:59:31] <Philantrop>	Ok, first. Objections?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [21:59:42] <Philantrop>	Perfect. *g* Anything else for topic 8 - Miscellaneous?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:00:07] <deathwing00>	can we go now? there's so much to do... *g*
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:00:12] <genstef>	btw, I am at Cebit tomorrow :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:00:17] Join	zsz has joined this channel (n=zsz@sa-184-64.saturn.infonet.ee).
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:00:18] <Philantrop>	Ok, guys, final topic - Date of the next meeting and closing.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:00:19] <gentoofan23>	well, I'm out, later everyone
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:00:19] <genstef>	eh on the weekend
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:00:21] <zlin>	second thursday is council meetings. not sure if that's a pro or a con though. :>
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:00:24] <gentoofan23>	Congrats, Philantrop
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:00:40] <Philantrop>	zlin: Oh, right. Then it's really first. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:00:52] <deathwing00>	yes
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:00:57] <genstef>	gentoofan23: goodbye :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:01:04] <Philantrop>	Last topic: Date of the next meeting and closing.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:01:11] Quit	gentoofan23 has left this server (Client Quit).
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:01:16] <Philantrop>	April, 3rd, 2008.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:01:30] 	 * zlin acks
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:01:33] <deathwing00>	noted
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:01:43] <brot>	:)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:01:44] <Philantrop>	Anything else, guys? :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:01:50] Topic	Ingmar sets the channel topic to "KDE 4.0 guide: http://tinyurl.com/27tbt5 | KDE herd meeting (april 3rd, 2008, 19:30 UTC, here). Agenda: http://tinyurl.com/2hhsvc | Problems upgrading to stable KDE 3.5.8? http://tinyurl.com/yqk4le | http://dev.gentoo.org/~masterdriverz/kde-help.txt | KDE Bugs: http://tinyurl.com/3bpdlv | If we're too quiet try #kde | KDE4 live ebuilds? -> "kde" overlay and #genkdesvn. | KDE 4 doesn't work with qt-4.4 *yet*".
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:01:51] <brot>	yes.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:02:05] <brot>	you missed to say that you all are doing a great job.
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:02:26] <ctennis>	Hats off to the qt4 beta1 folks
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:02:38] <Philantrop>	No, that's closing and that's what I'm doing now: Thanks for all your great work, guys! It's a great pleasure to work with you! :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:03:00] <berniyh>	ctennis: you mean "heads off" ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:03:08] <ctennis>	that too!
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:03:33] Quit	mark_alec has left this server ("Konversation terminated!").
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:03:35] <Philantrop>	ctennis: And it's nice to have one of the grumpy old men back on IRC. ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:03:47] <deathwing00>	:)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:03:58] <ctennis>	heh
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:04:07] <ctennis>	I wish I had more time to play
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:04:28] <ctennis>	but it seems like there's no problem  in picking up my slack
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:04:34] <deathwing00>	:)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:04:34] <Philantrop>	Ok, guys, this meeting is now officially closed! :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:04:46] 	 * deathwing00 cheers at the new lead
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:04:56] <berniyh>	ctennis: with qt-4.4?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:04:57] <zlin>	ctennis: :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:04:58] <Philantrop>	ctennis: Oh, you should have seen Ingmar and zlin swear about Qt's build system sometimes... ;-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:05:11] 	 * berniyh nods
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:05:13] <zlin>	we're still swearing.. ;)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:05:23] <Philantrop>	I'll mail the log and summary to kde@. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:05:46] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: I'll reuse it :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:06:04] <Philantrop>	deathwing00: That was my dark intention. :-)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:06:21] <deathwing00>	:)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:07:04] <keytoaster>	okay, zlin forced me to say that I vote for philantrop and against a sub-lead
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:07:37] <Philantrop>	LOL
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:07:37] <keytoaster>	err
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:07:44] <keytoaster>	s/.*I vote/I vote/
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:07:52] <deathwing00>	keytoaster: noted
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:09:35] <brot>	ehrm, when will the 4.0.2 ebuilds be in portage ?
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:09:44] <deathwing00>	Philantrop: I'll post the most interesting things on our forums btw :)
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:09:49] 	 * brot ducks
+[Do Mär 6 2008] [22:10:09] <Philantrop>	deathwing00: Thanks! :-) Please let me know the link. :-)
diff --git a/meeting-logs/kde-herd-meeting-summary-20080306.txt b/meeting-logs/kde-herd-meeting-summary-20080306.txt
new file mode 100644
index 0000000..3208285
--- /dev/null
+++ b/meeting-logs/kde-herd-meeting-summary-20080306.txt
@@ -0,0 +1,80 @@
+Summary for the Gentoo KDE herd meeting on Thursday, 6th of March 2008
+
+Participants:
+caleb, cryos, deathwing00, genstef, ingmar, jmbsvicetto, keytoaster, philantrop, tgurr,	zlin
+
+1. Bump to KDE 3.5.9:
+
+Apart from a few minor issues, the bump to KDE 3.5.9 went well. 
+
+https://bugs.gentoo.org/211116 (mixing split and monolithic ebuilds) was
+discussed. 3 participants didn't want the current behaviour changed, 3 were in
+favour of changing it. Thus, it was agreed that Ingmar, who volunteered to 
+change it, should feel free to do it.
+
+2. KDE 3.5.8 in stable for 2008.0.
+
+Philantrop stated that KDE 3.5.8 will be in the 2008.0 release.
+
+3. Removal of KDE < 3.5.8 from the tree.
+
+gentoofan23 brought up the issue of the removal of older (specifically 3.5.7)
+stable KDE versions from the tree after about 19 days and asked for a longer
+period for users to upgrade to the newest stable version.
+30 days were suggested as a rule of thumb and agreed upon by the majority of
+the participants.
+
+4. State of KDE4 in the tree.
+
+Ingmar and zlin gave a short information about KDE4 in the tree. The ebuilds in
+the tree are in a pretty good state. Their dependencies need to be updated for
+compatibility with the newly introduced split Qt-4.4 ebuilds.
+
+KDE 4.0.2 is currently planned to be included in the tree during the weekend.
+(p.masked)
+
+Anyone who wants to help with the bump to 4.0.2 should simply mail Philantrop
+his ssh public key. Interested users who can show they're able and willing to
+work on ebuilds are *explicitly* invited, too.
+The bump to 4.0.2 is taking place in a git overlay again to allow for non-ebuild
+devs to participate, too, and it's a great way to become a dev as Ingmar and
+zlin can verify.
+
+5. Herd Testers: Current state and next steps.
+
+The HT stuff was delayed because of the trustee elections, etc.
+jmbsvicetto and deathwing00 agreed to flesh out the work of a KDE Herd Tester
+and publish information about it on the usual Gentoo news channels (pr@g.o, 
+GMN, Forums).
+
+6. Lead election:
+
+Having a sub-lead was discussed to ensure not to have a single point of failure
+in case the lead disappears. In a vote, 3 herd members expressed their wish for
+a sub-lead, 5 voted against it and there was one abstention. Thus, the notion
+was rejected.
+
+deathwing00 initiated a vote for the lead. Philantrop was nominated and accepted
+the nomination.
+Philantrop was voted for by 9 of the participants, no votes against him and no
+abstentions. Thus, Philantrop was elected the lead of the Gentoo KDE project.
+
+deathwing00 is going to inform the GMN, pr@g.o and post it on the forums.
+
+7. Review of the project page
+
+gentoofan23 and deathwing00 volunteered to update the project page with respect
+to KDE versions and other information in the sections 3, 4, 8 and 9 till the
+next meeting.
+
+8. Miscellaneous
+
+It was decided to re-instate the monthly meetings on the first Thursday each 
+month.
+
+9. Date of the next meeting and closing.
+
+The next KDE herd meeting takes place on Thursday, 3rd of April 2008.
+
+Philantrop thanked all the Gentoo KDE people for their great work and their
+trust in him.